In Defense of Ma’am

posted on August 31, 2010

this article has 25 comments

We say Grace, and we say Ma’am. If you ain’t into that we don’t give a damn. Hank Williams, Jr.

Here we go. It’s open season on polite interactions between the sexes and the latest endangered species has just landed in the sites of the modern equalizers. The word Ma’am. This article in the New York Times has pushed a button here at SP. Something about a woman complaining about being called Ma’am. “Behind the link between “ma’am” and “old” is the familiar feminist observation that, whereas a man remains “mister” and “sir” from nursery to nursing home, a woman’s honorifics change depending on her marital status and, barring that, her age,” Professor Lady says. She is a professor and she is a lady (we presume). No disrespect is meant by either of those terms. There is no argument from these quarters on this statement. We do make the distinction between Miss and Ma’am based on perceived age and we do differentiate between a man and a woman. These are truths. But other truths include having to shave, mowing the lawn and taking out the garbage. There are differences between the sexes, physical, mental and in the interactions in the world of the mannered classes. I do completely realize the simplicity of this defense, but that is the point. It’s that simple.

To give a little empathy to Professor Lady’s plight, first let me say that I have entered the age where people sometimes call me sir. And yes, it’s a little unsettling when you think you are Peter Pan dashing around town and someone other than a sales clerk says, “Yes, Sir.” (Service people should always use respectful honorifics when dealing with the public). This is as inevitable as weight gain and student loan bills. You get older and with that come changes. We have to deal with it. Growing up in the Deep South one would never answer a question without Yes Ma’am or Yes Sir when speaking with an adult. It is deference and respect and instead of complaining about this one last little vestige of civility this society clings to, the occurrence should be applauded and rewarded. You can’t have it both ways, I’m afraid. It comes with the territory. We can’t drill our boys — and that’s what we are talking about here – to respect their elders and then tell them to stop because we don’t want to feel old. Sorry. If you don’t like the title or appreciate the honor then politely ask the speaker not to use it in your case.

Don’t get me wrong. Deploying the word Ma’am can be awkward as you get older. It is an on-the-spot call every man must make as he enters his mid-twenties. Do I call this woman Ma’am? Is she my mother’s age or my sister’s? We definitely do not want to offend a woman when all we mean is respect. See the dilemma? I have on more than one occasion been upbraided by a woman for calling her ma’am and took note and did not call her that again. But we are not about to stop using this term. God forbid. Would you rather someone address you by your first name? That’s next if we continue to tear down the walls. Let’s leave the civilities alone, shall we? In this age of rampant rudeness, you would think the presence of masculine grace would be appreciated. We will stand up when you walk into the room. We will hold the door for you to pass through. We will walk on the curbside of the street. We will even offer you our jacket to stave off an evening chill. This is what we do. This is our role and one we feel comfortable being in. So please, for the love of Pete, don’t take that away. If you want the courtesies and benefits of polite society, cut a brother a little slack in the deployment of ma’am, Ma’am.

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this post has 25 comments

I think it’s also important to remember that those distinctions were made for men in the past as well. On occasion I still am referred to as “master” as a prefix to my own name in the company of my parents and their (equally) aged friends. It’s also an antiquated term, but as I’d like to point out, one delivered fondly and warmly, not with the intent of reminding me of “my place” or something of that nature. We don’t see that used much anymore either. And to this day I still call my parents’ friends by their last names, even though they may address correspondence more informally. It’s not always what they want. They sometimes see it as a disappointing reminder of their age, and reluctantly I’m pressed into first names for an hour or two of cocktails a month. But most of the time they get what I’m attempting to communicate: courtesy, respect, and an appreciation for their attention. And, being a single male, those are exactly the things I want to communicate to the opposite sex with a miss or a ma’am.

posted on November 2, 2011

Clay Whittaker

3457
I just now stumbled onto this article, and I must say I agree with it. In the world I live in, that of politeness and hospitality that other parts of our great land have cast aside in the name (and name only) of social advancement, Barbara Boxer and Dr. Kroll are considered to lack the grace needed to handle a polite comment. They come across as crude and lacking in civility, despite their education and prominent positions. It is really a sad world where women have such a chip on their shoulder that they cannot recognize respect. Whether anyone likes it or not, gender exists. It’s not something we have a choice over. Our society has done good to erase many stereotypes and limitations that were applied to gender in the past, but in doing so, has taken unnecessarily steps to erase any recognition that gender does in fact exist.

posted on October 21, 2010

Jeremy Eubanks

1908
The use of Sir or Ma’m is polite only when the name is not known, or a more suitable title is not known. It is impolite for a military officer to call a female senator ma’m. Senator will do. It is impolite for a youngster to call an elder Sir or Ma’m as if the person were a prep school master: Mr. So and So will do nicely. No academic should insist on doctor. At Cornell, every professor is called Mr. No lawyer with a Juris Doctor should call herself doctor. Even a lawyer with an earned Doctor of Judicial Science should be Mister, or Esquire in a written address. To have a full colonel call me Sir when I am a former captain, just because I am older, is ridiculous. I won’t call him Sir if I see his name or rank, because he does not outrank me. I am a civilian.

posted on October 15, 2010

jason gettinger

1892
Dear Readers,
We can sit here and solve all the worlds problems. Remember, we just solve them in our thoughts. I was raised a northern U.S. country boy. Be respectful and say,”Yes, sir. No, sir.(Yes Ma’am. No Ma’am) Thank you and please,” but we have to realize that manners are no longer taught to the masses. Few parents now days have the courage to correct and disipline their childern. I still use these terms. I even use the term,’Young lady’ when she looks like she is around 20 or younger and I get some of the strangest looks. The younger generation is not being educated with terms of respect and politeness so they definitely do not know how to react when they are treated with respect. It is a shame how America has lost such great values in approximately 40 years!!!!! Thank you respectfully, Wade

posted on October 13, 2010

Wade Anthony Reichelderfer

1888
Customs vary. In New England respect is shown by tone, language and deference and Southerners and Midwesterners may have difficulty discerning that respectfulness is occurring. For us, the use of sir & ma’am by children denotes smart-aleckiness, and by adults, belligerence, so of course we discourage it. If an adult calls you sir or ma’am, assume you have offended them in some way. Only acceptable usage is if a stranger forgets something in a store and you have to call out to them. Otherwise, these use should be avoided by people of all ages.

posted on October 10, 2010

Morag

1883
I enjoy the poke at professor lady. Sometimes people are too educated. I whole heartfelt agree with you sir, that etiquette has gone by the way side and has been traded in for modern convenience, and contrived progress. Keep up the good work of reminding people about politeness.

posted on September 21, 2010

Joey Dee

1835
Her name is Judith Kroll, and it annoys me greatly that you insist on calling her “Professor Lady,” as if to poke tongue-and-cheek fun at her accomplishments. (Putting a “no offense” meant disclaimer after it is like putting one after a racist joke – claiming it’s not meant as offensive doesn’t retroactively make it in good taste.) Were we to start assigning descriptive nouns instead of names, “Arrogant” and “Jackass” would certainly be technically correct and apt, but I doubt you have desire to be known by either.

And I sympathize greatly where she’s coming from – I kept my own name upon marriage, and it is still, in this day and age, a social minefield to do so – from being told by the insurance company “we can’t carry your husband if you’re not *really* married” to receiving wedding invitations that are not addressed to me, there is still a great deal of meaning around the way in which you refer to a woman’s title.

The fact that I also sympathize with your own point (I’d much rather be called “Miss” or “Ma’am” than “Hey, you!” by strangers) is largely diminished by the awkwardly misogynistic style you choose to present it in. A rare, rude stumble for SP, but a stumble none the less.

posted on September 19, 2010

Lily Beth Tempest

1829
Superb. In my experience, deploying “ma’am” is sometimes a risky business. I never had to think about my use of the word until I found myself an adult in the company of academics and baby Boomers, who seem rather sensitive about the business of getting old and dying.
I do think it is unfair to deny people the luxury of using an honorific in their social interactions. So often you meet people you will never see again; why should one be bothered with their name in that instance?

posted on September 18, 2010

NealDewing

1826
I have always found being called ma’am or miss by strangers to simply be a polite replacement for my name when it is not known. Maybe it is because my age has been assumed as many as 10 years younger, I have never been offended by someone using such as term in regards to aging me.
It is simply a sign of respect. It is better than being called Hey Lady! or Mrs. ummm (a common name I received when I taught high school). In my opinion, which everyone has and everyone’s is different, it is just as right to call a 6 year old ma’am as it is a 27 year old as it is a 68 year old.
In our world of failing manners I believe that ma’am will suffice. But I am glad to hear the difference between miss and ma’am, because while I was brought up in the South, I was brought up by very liberal parents who never instilled in me yes ma’am and no ma’am, although would applaud it.

posted on September 15, 2010

Ryann

1819
I have to laugh when Southerners speak as if they are the only ones taught to use Ma’am and Sir- I am from the Midwest and was taught the same. What it boils down to is you were taught or not and if you chose to use what you were taught or not. Plain and simple.

posted on September 8, 2010

Barbara

1805
I grew up in the South, Southern Louisiana specifically, and I was called ma’am when I was still in single digit age, especially if I was acting ‘too big for my britches’, as it were. There, if you were a female, you were ma’am, just as all men were sir. You would call your friend’s mother Mrs. ‘Last Name Here’ and only when you became very close to the family could you call her Miss First Name. This was standard stuff. When I moved from the South to New Mexico, it was a whole different ball game. I literally cringed the first time a friend of mine called my mother by her first name, no Mrs., no nothing! They weren’t being rude, that was just how they’d been brought up. It took a very long time to get used to it!

Now I’m raising my daughter out here in NM, but I make her say yes ma’am and no ma’am. Other people giggle and call her quaint when they hear her, and it embarrasses her a bit, but if she doesn’t put a ma’am behind that yes or no when talking to me, I pretend I don’t hear her.

Manners are a lost art!

posted on September 5, 2010

Emily

1800
Sir, I simply love your blogs! I 100% agree with APC. I am 41, live in GA and use “ma’am” and “sir” with people of all ages as a sign of respect and sometimes to alert them: “Ma’am, you left your debit card” or “Sir, your shoe is untied.” People rarely seem offended, though I must admit when someone calls me “Ma’am” I have to bite my tongue sometimes, get over feeling old, and recognize that their “mama raised them right.”

posted on September 4, 2010

bunny

1798
You know where I stand on this, but I do acknowledge that it is about where I was raised. My sister-in-law who is from the mid-West thinks that “yes, Ma’am” sounds condescending, and therefore does not require her children to say it (to the horror of their Southern grandparents, I might add). Recently I heard a nationally known speaker in the healthcare arena talk of her experience with her mother as a patient. She said that she told her mother’s nurses and physicians, “She’s not ‘honey’, ‘miss’ or ‘ma’am’ – her name is Jane.” I was very taken back to hear ma’am lumped in with the ‘honey’ reference, but I really do think it is just a matter of geography. All that said, my Southern ears and heart may never warm to the exclusion of ‘ma’am.’

posted on September 2, 2010

Elisabeth ~ Babbette

1796
[...] felt awkward when I did stand up, or adhere to the more strict tenants of general polite behavior. Here and now, reader, I pledge to be more polite in my behavior, as I read this quote earlier on one… In this age of rampant rudeness, you would think the presence of masculine grace would be [...]

posted on September 2, 2010

A Dearth of Manners » The Dean Files

1795
Christy from slowsouthernstyle.com here, so of course I know all about ma’am. We throw that around just as effortlessly and unapologetically as “y’all”. It isn’t uncommon for people of the same age,older, even younger to call someone by ma’am.

And I love the song reference!

posted on September 1, 2010

Christy

1793
If you see a wedding ring refer to her as “Ma’am, if you don’t see a ring refer to her as “Miss”. Perhaps I’m mistaken, but it is the marital status that precludes “Ma’am” or “Miss”. Am I wrong?

posted on August 31, 2010

Elizabeth

1792
[...] I’m a huge fan of this site called Social Primer. Yes, more etiquette speak but from the male’s point of view. I find it all-oh so [...]

posted on August 31, 2010

SOCIAL PRIMER « LA Gossip Girls

1791
I’m also a “lady professor”, and I have to say that I was really annoyed with that article. I wanted to yell “don’t ruin it for the rest of us!” when I read about how she demands her students to call her anything but Mrs. X. Let’s face it – 18 year old kids mess up sometimes and forget your name. They’re not trying to be insulting, they’re just used to their high school teachers. To over-react to their respectful use of Mrs. is in worse taste than their forgetting to use “Dr.” And I don’t consider “Mrs.” an insult.

I feel that flaunting the “Dr.” is in the worst taste anyway. I always follow the 1931 version of Emily Post’s Etiquette – academics should only use the “Dr.” when they are talking to students or about to give a presentation.

posted on August 31, 2010

Melissa

1790
I appreciate it when anyone calls me “sir”. I’m 34.

I deploy “Ma’am” with extreme caution, usually when I’m certain the woman will take it as sign of respect rather than an insult. And I never use “Miss”. But I will drop the occasional “mademoiselle” on a woman just to catch her off guard.

posted on August 31, 2010

L. C.

1789
As a older true Southern Ma’am I salute you SP. This to me has nothing to do with age, it is respect for another person. I once worked with a gentleman younger than I but he was the boss. I said Yes Sir to him out of respect for him being my boss even though we were great friends. Although we live in a different world than the one I was brought up in, good manners, respect and morals have not changed, it is only the people who make the difference and change the rules.

posted on August 31, 2010

APC

1787
Amen! This is a topic I have discussed with fellow Southerners and we are all perplexed when our expressions of respect are treated with contempt. Being polite is not backward or subservient. I personally use “sir” and ma’am” with people of all ages, sometimes a bit tongue-in-cheek, but at all times to show respect to my friends and family or to demonstrate it to those younger than myself. I dislike the word “class” because of how it is so often used to divide people but being polite and showing you can spare a moment’s thought for someone else will always be the standard to which we should all aspire. Thank you for your posts!

posted on August 31, 2010

ncfarmchick

1786
Although it is a slight shock to be called ma’am at times because it does sound ‘mature’, I much prefer that to nothing at all. The presence of ‘masculine grace’, as you state, IS appreciated, and it is unfortunately rare. Take the chance and call us ma’am or miss, it truly is appreciated.

posted on August 31, 2010

S. N. Carpeaux

1785
This is just too complicated of a concept to be swept into the big basket of, “Life ain’t what it used to be.” For further thoughts on the concept of “Lady,” I’d be deeply appreciative if you took a peek at my post here. http://bit.ly/bby36e

posted on August 31, 2010

Lisa

1784
As a Southern girl, the 1st time I used the term up north in a crowded drug store, I was shocked when everyone fell silent and looked as if i’d swallowed a horse. I had no idea that treating people with respect was such an insult in other parts if the country, but I found out quickly.

posted on August 31, 2010

Hannah B

1783
[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Unabashedly Prep, M.R. , M.R. , Trip Reed, Social Primer and others. Social Primer said: In defense of the word Ma'am on today's SP. http://fb.me/Hs2EGh7B [...]

posted on August 31, 2010

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